Handshakes Challenges to Mass Adoption

On Handshake’s website it describes the protocol as “An experimental peer-to-peer root naming system”. Being an experimental protocol means that there are many potential bumps in the road that the community will have to overcome. In this panel we’ll discuss some of these bumps and potential solutions for these problems.


(00:01) [Music] [Applause] so [Music] [Applause] [Music] [Music] [Applause] [Music] yeah thank you thank you uh he’s on the

(01:09) panel to jahan uh kinetic capital for your uh your response one of your key sponsorships of this second candy con also co-founded the hindicon with me last year thank you jahan for your support for the events and the community at general um all right so we have another amazing panel an action-packed day too uh this will you help put this one together with me you wanna say some ports yeah this one was kind of last minute this was supposed to be a like contrarian type panel we were going to try to get adam curry and brendan nike

(01:47) to come and talk you know since they’ve been pretty public about handshake and whatnot and being on the other side of the river uh being like in the middle or or kind of against it um but they weren’t available uh we tried to get in contact with them so we thought another good replacement for this would be uh the challenges to mass adoptions uh so like what uh what we’ll face in the future uh bumps in the roads um that we could see potentially great so let’s yeah we got a lot of great stuff to talk about so i think

(02:21) this one i will just uh let you guys take it from here okay and of course questions and answers are welcome in the in the from the audience i think uh that’ll be a great part of this can can i can i start does anybody have an opening statement no it’s kind of open open-ended so however i i actually love um kind of flooding handshake from the from the from the developer perspective um you’re coming from like a several years as a bitcoiner and sort of thinking that like all coins are things that don’t work and now working on one

(02:58) um when anybody asks what the obstacles are that handshake faces the easiest thing to do is go find all the blog posts that brantley milligan has ever written because he enumerates them um and they’re pretty simple like why did ens build on ethereum instead of starting their own blockchain which is what handshake did and i think the top three are uh collisions with icann tlds um security i mean like nobody can argue that ethereum has less security than handshake you know we have like three mining pools and we’ve seen the hash rate from all those

(03:31) pools go up and down in sync which suggests co-location you know we we need more security um and like creating a new token and um what are the other things he’s written about so yeah those kind of things like our real um are real obstacles technically and there was a discussion on github where people wanted to remove the word experimental from the handshake.

(03:53) org website which i’m i’m against the word experimental is still on bitcoin.org and even on the bitcoin core github and i think there’s a lot of things that we don’t know about handshake yet and what’s going to happen to it um yeah what do you what do you what do you think jj what do you think about like the you know like the hash rate and actual security and like when i you know a lot in your last talk you you said that handshake is a success but would you still consider it an experiment yeah i would still consider it an

(04:22) experiment and um i mean whatever is happening with the mining pools this is what i like about truffle work versus proof of state is group of states all right actually i should start with proof war proof of work obviously can get centralized it’s happened on bitcoin there there’s there’s been mining pools that have controlled 51 percent on bitcoin before g hash in 2014 had over 51 percent hash rate um so a lot of people may see that as a shortcoming of proof of work with proof of stake the centralization is coming

(04:57) from within as as um as a protocol rule like you you need to follow this cabal of signers and you need to tell the client which which group of signers to follow so it’s it’s not short-lived like it is on proof-of-work systems and i feel like those mining empires they they come and go like and they’ve come and gone on bitcoin like i think g hash is still around it was a big mining pool back in the day but now it’s like i think it’s like single digits percentage hash rate like and then before that there was like deep

(05:36) bit really early on they mined like most of most of the blocks so like early on in the bitcoin blockchain and now nobody’s ever heard of them even on handshake we had six block um which like surprised most of us right off the bat with like a huge amount of hash rate and i don’t think they even have one percent anymore yeah so i feel like yes centralization is a problem on proof of work but the lovely thing about proof of work is that it is permissionless anybody can join the network and start mine and it’s not you know

(06:11) it’s a truly permissionless system and i think i think those mining empires like they come and go so it is a problem but i think it’s a temporary problem yeah i agree i mean like it’s permissionless that anybody can start mining but they do need to buy a 4 000 piece of hardware from one single company that makes all of our asics and if they’re sold out then you can’t or they need to come up with a new hardware optimization that their hardware company hasn’t done right right which which you know props to you guys

(06:42) for for picking a proof of work algorithm that was easy to make an asic for but had no asics yet but i think that was smart but what what we need to happen is to have a second manufacturer and more mining pools and i don’t think that will happen until we add value to the system until handshakes so exciting and valuable that someone’s like we need to compete with gold shelter eating our lunch and you know then we’ll really be heading to the moon i don’t think there’s going to be any competition in this space until there as

(07:10) you said there’s more value in this space and you know i think that it’s just such a challenge i mean you know i can’t really speak anything to the technical side because i’m not technical but from the business side or from the investment side i think one of the biggest challenges is actually getting the attention uh of investors i mean another sounds super lame and a kind of a very decentralized kind of community but the fact is that i think i’m like kinetic is still probably the most active vc in handshake

(07:36) which is terrible because we really need more activity uh and it’s great that so many developers are spending their own time but they need to be able to graduate into you know a seed round a series a they need to be able to actually kind of grow and um and i think that until we actually you know reach back out to some of the initial investors in handshake get them you know educated and interested and invested again not just in money but in time and belief and passion and community we’re going to be in this kind

(08:04) of you know running in circles a little bit the technology will be great um but the adoption will kind of suffer so let’s throw that out there i’d love to hear what you guys think about the the kind of maybe the dirty side which is like the money side of of the protocol but it’s kind of necessary in my mind yeah uh jump in here and from like a you know kind of a builder perspective kind of on that i mean we’ve seen like over the past year or two that you know there’s been a ton of great new

(08:36) you know proof of concept products built on top of handshake and there’s a lot of progress in that in that regard in experimentation but in terms of adoption to to get back to to get back to what you were saying john about uh the business side of it i think a lot of the you know a lot of the pro like for adoption for newcomers to come in and to see kind of the value and to try to take take some of that uh get some action and skin in the game in in terms of the the new technologies being developed they have to kind of see that

(09:12) that something these products that are being built are sustainable and they that they’re not just ephemeral you know like in in in terms of a business perspective if you want to integrate with handshake somehow uh having a product that you can trust is not just a some little bitty side project and that’s something that could that could that could be reliable uh in terms of enterprise use for example i think that’s probably one of the biggest uh next steps in in that regard um yeah so seeing some of these these these

(09:52) projects and stuff that are being around being built around handshake to get to that next step i think there’s got to be a lot more like you said maybe some investor of investors coming in to support that kind of development or or just generally having a lot larger of a developer base to begin with but yeah i think that’s probably the next step in getting towards that adoption i think uh let’s go ahead john okay fine i’ll go i was i was going to bring up the fact that like by design the the founders and we have two of them

(10:24) here so i’d love to hear andrew and jj talk about this um you guys raised money you gave it all away that i don’t know any other blockchain project that’s ever done that if you had kept one million dollars we could have had a team of 10 developers for the first year working full-time on handshake or five whatever it is you know with healthcare um so part of the design of the project was that it was not going to be another scam coin that everybody sees is just kind of like corporate backed and um with a marketing department and i get

(10:54) messages from people on telegram every single day they’re like oh i’m a youtuber for a thousand dollars i’ll mention you or like we’re in exchange and where our listing fees are this and the best part is i’m like we don’t have any money so like i don’t care if you’re real or a scam like you’re talking to a rock here i can’t you know so i i love that about handshake but like that is an obstacle that you guys put into the system intentionally yeah that was very intentional like we would

(11:21) we didn’t want this coin to be like another foundation coin it’s just it’s it’s a point of centralization and it’s also like a huge source of drama and it’s been a huge source of drama and like any coin you could look at was there’s a huge source of drama in bitcoin there’s a huge source of drama and ethereum and then yeah that’s just a giant point of centralization so it’s like the downside is is you maybe can’t iterate as fast because you can’t just you know like pay some

(11:50) developers to do something to you know try to get adoption or whatever but it’s it’s the price you have to pay if you want to be more decentralized yeah i think that’s probably part of the challenge too is is to make sure that in in trying to get towards that adoption and try to to build out something on a larger scale that you don’t and unintentionally go through out of just recentralizing everything and and uh on a higher layer of the network topology um because then then it kind of invalidates

(12:27) the purpose of the underlying blockchain but uh i mean given enough competition in the space that should be unavoidable but you know at such early stage it’s hard to see that uh properly play out so i do have a i do have a question for jihan um and a question for everyone um but for jihan so the funny thing is like i think last year i was like i i also noticed like hey like original handshake investors aren’t really super active um we should reach out to them get them more involved help us um push some things and then the the

(13:04) main the thing that really held us back from doing so is like how how can they specifically help like do you kind of have an idea of like how you would love to see like sequoia or someone come in and like what specific action they can take to help handshake or i mean i’ll tell you how what what we do and maybe that’s that’s that’ll give you some idea of you know what much larger kind of storied firms can do i mean so for example so yeah we we instead not only did we pay for the the handshake hacker

(13:35) house um but we thought of it right we initiated the entire thing just because we wanted some type of like you know hacker activity to to kind of focus on handshake um you know mike and i created this handycon right so um there are so many things that can that can be done um we were behind like we formed with uh chango and with uh the do web foundation simply because in order to get listed on exchanges you have to face the exchange has to face a an entity and there’s no entity that they could face in order to actually put

(14:10) in the application so that was one of the major roadblocks in order to actually get listed on exchange so there’s all these different kind of things that actually require a proper business space so the decentralized aspect in the beginning is is beautiful and amazing but it doesn’t scale and it doesn’t solve some of the very kind of practical and tactical issues um that growing you know a protocol in 2022 uh requires um none you know the least of which is is definitely funding uh and developer time

(14:39) and and all these things so i just think that we’re the way that you guys designed it is amazing um i just wonder like you know what else do we need in 2022 to actually make sure that um someone doesn’t just fork this um commercialize it uh relaunch it uh get you know 100 million dollars of funding or 50 million dollars of funding or whatever and actually you know drive it forward obviously would have a different type of you know maybe that would be like unstoppable domains or whatever but i feel like we’re just in a

(15:09) different phase and you know for me and i might be wrong it just requires a different potentially different type of approach um in order to get it from you know where we are uh to to where we all want it to go so um there’s a lot that they can do it’s influenced exposure it’s education it’s funding it’s uh you know developers it’s you know it’s it’s the entire ecosystem i’m not saying investors are the only solution right but they’re a catalyst yeah i think the point i’m trying to

(15:38) drive i’m trying to really clarify on is like what is like a specific action we can ask them on instead of hey we want you to get more involved in handshake i don’t know up to them to figure it out you just need to be engaged when i talk to some of the early the early investors because i did this with you last year i went around to some of the early investors like hey you invested in handshake what whatever happened to that part of the challenge was that so many of them invested only got like like us we only got like 50k i think in the in

(16:06) the round um and i think the largest allocation was like 300k and that was uh maybe to andrewsson or something like this i don’t know but it was it was low hundreds i think um and that out of like federal what’s that it might have been founders i think the highest is one point five maybe one five million yeah really then those guys should be involved that that’s that’s a huge that is a that is a question for us i mean because like to match point we just donated all the money anyway right so so so so basically i mean there is a

(16:40) question like it goes uh from the earth lasting like what are some things that we could have done differently maybe we could have just raised more and donated more you know um i mean and maybe well but but to your question do you think vcs if they had like you know instead of 50 or you know if everybody had you know 10 or some multiple some order of magnitude more um higher allocation i do think at the time that there was demand for it um that that i mean we could have probably raised it and burned it but like do you

(17:10) think the behavior of these institutions or firms would be used 100 million percent like obesity’s time is is weighted by the size of their investment if they have a you know a 200 million dollar fund and their investment i think size might have lost you hand for a second but i think we can tell where he was going with that right if if a fund had a 200 million dollar investment then they’re more inclined to put in another one million to profit on that here’s consideration i mean you know there’s something i mean i

(17:48) think we did i mean it didn’t it wouldn’t have really mattered to us because you know or i guess the biggest benefactor would have been the nonprofits who would have gotten more money because yeah yeah i mean that that was sort of an experimental it’s on like the silicon valley experiment yeah i think that applies to the air drop in the reserve names too like there’s 180 000 dev popular open source developers that could could also be looking at it you know to jihan’s point like the same way like oh i’m invested i’m i’m

(18:21) invested in handshake i woke up one morning and i just happened to be invested in handshake and um you know 99 of those developers don’t know that they have an airdrop or haven’t claimed and um maybe that you know and then that doesn’t expire like the reserve names you know there’s still time to to try to find those developers and see if they’re interested if they still have their private key although i do think the rsa 1024 keys do expire if the miners activate the software right i thought that was just the dns

(18:51) sect is that what applies to their job too oh okay so then on the point like point of this panel again it’s like handshake challenges to mass adoptions i think a really natural question for everyone is really like what do you guys think are the largest blockers to handshake adoption right now right on the massive list jihan was talking about a week i got vc’s involved to do this this this but like specifically what are the blockers to adoption um and then we can kind of uh kind of brainstorm like uh specific solutions to those blockers

(19:26) right so uh to some obvious ones don’t mention coin listing and don’t mention browser adoption because those are like um what was the second one thing and the second one pointless listings and browser adoption right those are like the reason i say don’t mention those is because beyond um for coin listing beyond submitting like a coin listing application um there’s not really much action you can take there right uh like coinbase just for context like their coin listing process is so opaque that like even

(19:58) people in the coin listing teams don’t know what coins are going to be listed uh no i actually investors that push coin listings like that’s how that’s how coins get listed you have the team and then you have the investors who actually help apply and help go behind the scenes like hey we really believe in this and you know there’s all these other investors who really believe in this too and you know if you list this then we would love to trade it we would love to support it and that kind of stuff actually works

(20:25) part of the application process they look who invested in it and who’s active so yeah um the obstacle that i see like you mentioned browser adoption like the nice thing about if if like brave integrates handshake is that all those users will just suddenly have handshake without realizing it but um you know the obstacle that we have is installing something or if opera turns out to be the only major browser i mean right now we have a browser it’s called beacon and um there’s maybe a thousand people who have it installed

(20:56) um so you know the problem with all this decentralized stuff is is convenience convenience is always the enemy of decentralization and the whole cypherpunk thing we fight against convenience and we always lose um you know it’s the same thing with bitcoin too like if i want to send you bitcoin are you going to sync your full notes that you can trust the payment and blah blah blah and use bitcoin no you’re going to open a coinbase account your money’s not going to go to you at all and yeah so convenience is is a big problem

(21:27) and just you know and then content which is why we want to do this handshake uh website race get you know have some websites on there so when you go say hey i’m really into handshake and and you should check it out you should install fingership you should install beacon and then like okay cool i did that now now what uh can i type in and it’s like uh there’s like a couple um so that’s that’s important yeah i think on the on the convenience aspect of it it’s hard to um reconcile that you know like as a

(21:57) early you know adopter of something like this and if you’re developing something you really i mean the main the main goal is to try to bring people in by by offering uh an abstracted kind of uh onboarding process to the to the whole ecosystem right but you know you kind of reconcile that with with your desire to not become like you know some kind of decentralized or centralized uh you know platform that does all sorts of all the aspects for them and then you ultimately are just asking for the user’s trust

(22:35) um and i mean there there are some things where that’s inevitable i think um for a lot of people they’re not going to be wanting to run their own dns server for example or they don’t even know what that means so so things like that i think i think that’s the i personally that’s what i’ve been working on with um creating like a domain hosting platform uh called foci um and uh yeah i think i think that’s probably the first in my mind the first uh necessary thing for you know broader adoption is to

(23:12) allow people a place that shows them a clear path to how to use handshake you know just on a personal level and then beyond that also allowing allowing greater access for developers to be able to to also integrate it like like they would you know just a regular domain name because you know dns is kind of like the back end of the back end and for most like especially like front end developers um so you know you you don’t want to have to be able to need to to reteach the entire system and then all you know base layer of all this just

(23:50) just to adopt to this new kind of weird technology that they don’t understand so you know i think once there’s like a you know proper base layer kind of services that are required that most people were not will not be willing to do themselves i think it becomes a lot easier after that to to you know build on top of that and explore the technology further yeah it kind of sounds like one thing you’re really touching upon um is kind of like the you the ux right um for the right the end user and developers like really poor ux it’s

(24:27) actually a problem with like pretty much every web 3 project you look anywhere the different compared to web 2 stuff i mean it’s a very changing experience still um i mean i i i i shudder to think about like if metamask didn’t exist like what the user experience would be um but with that said right um i i do think there is a really unique opportunity with handshake specifically um for even though it’s like a janky experience and whatnot um right now people really care about learning about blockchain and

(25:03) i think with handshake specifically there’s a really unique uh opportunity to uh frame handshake as even like an onboarding tool for no coiners into the blockchain space um it’s kind of difficult to really understand like okay treasury um decentralizing finance why that matters but dns is so easy to understand it’s like okay you know what a domain name right it’s like here’s something really cool is did you know like top level domains and whatnot and then it’s like i mean it’s literally like my party

(25:32) trick my party trick is to talk about dns and why handshake is like handshake is so cool right um and so my takeaway from there is i think even though the experience is really difficult there’s a lot of friction in the beginning um it we can frame it as a teaching tool uh you know to really onboard people right i mean it’s it’s the first blockchain i learned about and yeah there’s someone’s handshake it’s kind of um i think it’s more i mean the technical side is not necessarily the easiest thing for

(26:02) someone just brand new to you know to understand but you know from like a use case perspective i think compared to other blockchain kind of projects especially like d5 related stuff it’s a little bit more down to earth in in the abstract sense um and i think there’s i think a strong part of that is uh privacy and uh the anti-centralized control uh kind of sticking points especially if you can look at a lot of you know internet censorship in certain parts of the world and especially now within the last couple months with

(26:42) russia and ukraine and everything there’s been a lot more you know focus on in in national news international news about you know internet censorship and that kind of stuff and and russia has been trying to get their own private dns separate from the internet which is a whole other topic rabbit hole to go down but i think that i mean because of that that i think that’s that’s it makes it a lot more um you know apparent you know for why why this exists and i think it’s yeah to your point it’s

(27:17) that’s probably one of the the best ways to kind of go at um explaining it to people yeah yeah i mean even petitioned i can to remove dot ru from the root zone yeah which i don’t know that’s kind of a that’s kind of a totally disagree it’s it’s it’s overreaching but um yeah the handshake does solve that yeah yeah and then you get you know with handshake then you get your own kind of problems with that kind of stuff too but that’s again that’s a whole rabbit hole to go down at least it it’s you know i do when i

(27:53) had not be able to solve that now i shudder to think what would happen if everybody in russia like installed h and sd and try to connect to full nodes yeah or or you know like given our hash rate like could the united states government just be like oh handshake is how russia is evading sanctions you know they probably have enough gpu power in the basement of the pentagon to wipe us out i don’t know yeah i don’t i don’t really understand hash rates but um like my my source of truth is crypto51.

(28:28) app um and it i’m just looking at numbers but antique actually seems to have pretty sizable hash rates compared to like even ethereum um but i could be understanding this wrong we could talk about that really quick because i did some quick numbers and i think crypto app 51 is is close on that too basically like if you mine a handshake block you get 2000 hns it’s worth basically 400 using um the latest top of the line gold shell asic it probably will cost you about 150 dollars worth of electricity to mine that block that’s not even

(29:00) counting the 5 000 you spend on the device so um so that’s cheap in my opinion i don’t know exactly off the top of my head how that compares to bitcoin but you know if we were up against a nation-state attack especially us versus russia you know for crying out loud like um you know it wouldn’t surprise me to see a lot of transactions get censored or blocks being unwound yeah at this point i don’t think the united states could do that to bitcoin probably not ethereum either i don’t know maybe jj andrew has more insight to that

(29:34) but um i mean that sounds right yeah all right one thing i was just oh sorry go ahead no i was gonna actually completely shift gears so go ahead i was gonna do two i was gonna just have a thought it was like something to be briefly mentioned but i mean i think i think one road to mass adoption is um like sort of having a killer app like with bitcoin it was you know money or value or whatever you want to call it you know with ethereum it was like erc20s and d5 and nfts and all this other stuff but with i mean with handshake i think

(30:13) it could be like something as simple as just having like exclusive content that’s only on handshake you know it’s just like giving normal people a reason to use it and then they they feel good about using it like or having some kind of killer app like something something that really draws people to it like that that is one aspect of massive function i think and like all the all of the really successful coins do have like that killer app that killer feature that that everybody knows about it took like for ethereum it took like

(30:47) you know several years before like icos became kind of a thing and and for bitcoin i mean it was silk road right the silk roast grow use case that really drove a lot of the adoption even though i mean it’s not the sustaining ones and nor you know our icos on ethereum um but it was kind of like the thing that like kind of you know drew everybody in um in in in those cycles and um yeah i mean i think handshake you know like things like that like the world is kind of like in some kind of place where you know

(31:16) that kind of thing could happen where some kind of really cool use case coincides with you know the the world environment that we’re in um but yeah this i mean i mean in general since it’s like a mass adoption kind of um panel i mean like yeah i i think like it took if you kind of go back like you know bitcoin or ethereum or like with any of these top chains i mean they kind of like it took quite a few years like in the beginning before like something like that happened right like that momentum and use case drove it and yeah

(31:44) i think maybe you know handshake is kind of like you know kind of going another path but um but i yeah to jj’s point like yeah killer use case is it seems like the timing is primed for something like that there’s also like the killer use cases is actually just the the trading of the domains themselves i mean that that is the most engaging compelling use case it’s just that we don’t have the infrastructure to do it like we have name base but you know as much as i love name based and i’m an investor in name base it’s not

(32:09) perfect uh and it’s the only game you know the only real the largest game in town and it’s you know we just need a bit more i mean if there are developers out there they want to build better applications to make it more friendly to you know trade and collect like collecting domain names like that’s a mask that is the massive real world mainstream use case like unstoppable proved it ens is proving it uh and the entire you know i don’t know how many people in the audience are domainers but i bet you it’s more than

(32:36) ten um and that’s you know for people that are non-crypto right so there’s that almost need to that is one use case but that it it does only apply to like a certain population of people people uh who want to collect or speculate on domain names absolutely it doesn’t apply to just you know your average joe who not at all whatever not at all but you got to start somewhere right i mean like you have to kind of build some type of job i totally agree but i i mean i think there’s there can be like many killer features

(33:11) and many other use cases some and and all else equals here’s an idea so i i spoke to joseph uh and got to meet up with him in denver he thinks it’s a social network um with handshake names um with footnote right for me i would say if the developers are listening um gaming is like a real thing right now right um so gaming with handshake names you can imagine um like a trading card game where like emojis are like let’s say like fire type you can think like pokemon right uh or like chinese characters are a different

(33:48) type uh and that based on you know maybe the niamey rankings uh you can have different um stats uh and that are randomized as that and then who has the best you know handshake party uh and that plays directly into trading handshake games as well right that’d be something um i’d really love to see i’d be playing that all day that’s that’s a great idea that but we i’ll and i hate to kind of beat a dead horse here and then i’ll shut up but it always goes back to this idea that uh if we don’t have support uh financial

(34:19) support for developers to actually graduate into they’ll never get past their their first round like they’ll never get past a certain point because the idea that they’re gonna somehow you know magically generate enough revenue to actually bootstrap themselves um is like that’s not how you know software typically gets built maybe you can thread the needle but most won’t so i think that you know it’s a it was a beautiful beginning in the way that it was architected but if i’m just you know kind of very

(34:46) pragmatic about how to move forward we really need uh like the straightest line and most impactful way to actually jump start the next phase of handshake adoption i think actually is to um you know get investors involved because they they’re magnifiers they’re forced magnifiers and we don’t have you know handshake incorporated to kind of do the work that investors will do if they’re actually invested if we had a company they would do it but we don’t so you know either we have to keep going

(35:16) and hope the community can have the knowledge and experience and funding to do all the stuff that companies normally do um or we have to choose you know some actors and try to get them into it so for me i would say you know talk to talk to your network and educate them if you educate them about handshake they’ll get into it because it’s obvious why handshake is amazing and beautiful but it requires people to evangelize and evangelize two influencers like namely vcs and other people who can make a difference you

(35:45) know that’s how we got the opera integration like you know same thing to i know you said you wanted to shut up about the vc’s side of things but there’s one good question i think here in in in the chat we can it’s kind of relevant here maybe we can it was directed towards you john um from collin burke he says what what sub sectors flash categories within handshake do you perceive to be the most ripe for vc investment i think just generally outside of vc investment just just in terms of the road to adoption

(36:16) for anybody else um i’ll say something really really i’ll give you a tough truth like you know i hate to say it but it’s true i don’t think vcs will want to invest in in many handshake startups right now um because even if the founder is great uh even if the application makes sense the overall sector is too much of a sector risk like handshake is still too much of a protocol risk because there’s not enough you know listings they’re not enough activity there’s not enough interest there’s not enough backing in

(36:44) it um so even if the founder succeeds and even if the found even if the idea is good it could still fail as a business because it relies on a protocol which you know may not survive you know yeah i i i agree um there’s and then that’s kind of like one of the things that uh when i was first uh you know playing with handshake and stuff i was thinking about like what how does this translate into um you know business level kind of adoption and i i think the answer probably at this point would probably be in trying to build something that works

(37:21) as a bridge you know between both um handshake and the regular domain name system um if whatever you know application that you’re doing just have um if you can i mean it’s not possible with everything but um like for example domain hosting if you offer both side by side at you know one place where both domain uh systems can be hosted in the same place or or you know for example with email there’s um it’s basically like a wall between between both you can’t email out well you can’t email out

(37:54) you can’t email back in to handshake domains from like gmail per se so i think you know kind of bridging those kinds of worlds i think maybe the best you know strategy and in a business perspective so we are um super running short on time like three minutes um i i would just say um if you have to choose one thing that you can just push the entire community to go in a certain direction to help accelerate mass adoption what would it be like content content make web make websites don’t don’t just trade your

(38:26) names or accumulate names put some stuff up there yeah i would agree with 50. i think that’s a good route to go i think short of having like a killer use case like you know complete censorship freeze something which is you know extremely you know valuable and just obvious you know absent of that i would i would say obviously you know evangelize to vcs like explain and educate them why handshake is is great and then they’ll get it and then they’ll figure out a way to invest like you know i think go going going off the

(39:00) webcon just putting out web content i think one of the easiest ways is at least for developers or who know who hosts their own websites just just mirror mirror your current websites on on a domain you already have on handshake i think that’s the easiest you don’t have to do much you just just you know add it to the the server that you have is being hosted at both these domains and then you’re good to go one thing i’ll throw out that hasn’t been mentioned yet just in the last couple seconds here is tor browser tor

(39:30) is another alt alternative system that users have to opt in and install something it offers um a content outside of the regular web but it also offers privacy to access the regular web handshake does that too you know having your own recursive resolver offers you some privacy strategies that also gives you access to this content you can’t get normally and so i think we could compare ourselves not just to other blockchain projects but to other privacy and other broad browser projects like tor yeah i think that’s a good way that you

(40:00) probably you know work on a marketing tactic around that concept too i don’t something’s there on that front but yeah that’s that’s good yeah and and then if i had to um choose myself uh it’s actually nothing technical um really it would be um business development to onboarding like what are browsers and what are browsers really waiting for they want to see actual adoption usage what we’re talking about i would personally just want to see like reputable brands who care about decentralization um

(40:34) just to reach out to them and uh like nudge them to mirror their website onto a handshake name um now you have uh that and this is uh two pairs of one zone right not only do you get this adoption but you also it doubles as marketing as well right like say internet archive mirrors a website on handshake could could be some good pr as well um so if i had to push everybody in one direction it would be uh nudging reputable brands who already care about decentralization uh to mirror their websites onto handshake cool um i think that’s time

(41:13) thanks for letting me have the last sentence and then yeah we’ll pop out and move on to the next session all right great talking with you guys [Music] [Applause] [Music] so [Music] kinetic is a blockchain crypto investment firm based in hong kong and puerto rico founded in 2016 they were the first

(42:19) fund in hong kong and one of the earliest in asia with a portfolio of over 220 companies they were seed investors in such projects as ethereum parity and polka dot solana ftx and of course handshake and name base [Music] founder johan chu was an active investor and supporter of the handshake ecosystem over one hundred thousand domains co-founder of d-web foundation co-founder of handicon and sponsor of the handshake house at miami hack week 2022 [Music] [Applause] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Applause] [Music]

(43:20) [Applause] [Music] um [Music] [Applause] [Music] [Music] [Applause] you